Hi all,

I know that this will not be the most exciting question/topic, but is there a consensus on sulbutiamine safety? I use it acutely before maximal cardio activity, perhaps 20-25 times per year, and have done for the past four years without incident. Typically, we are talking 5 - 50 minutes at 160 - 185bpm.

I don't think there is any chronotropic or inotropic effect (subjectively), and the LD50 figures in rat and mouse studies are very high indeed (>5gm/per kg from Lookchem). The data in previous threads on kainate / excitotoxicity was, from what I could tell, chronic dosing, and a CNS concern. Everywhere else seems to treat it in a very relaxed manner.

I suppose the whole lack of clarity on mechanism of action has me slightly worried, and a general level of obsessiveness of late (about all supps). I would be taking it typically with a small amount of caffeine (in Biotest Spike - 1 tablet), and from time to time, ibuprofen 400-600mg + codeine (20-30mg), and inhaled salbutamol (400mcg). No other medications ongoing at the moment.

Given that even high-end stimulants (MPH, D-Amphetamine) seem to be given (comparatively) benign risk profiles for sudden cardiac events - I sort of thought it would be fine, except I have no idea how it actually works. Sulbutiamine is also not listed on the WADA catalogue of banned agents, which sort of suggests a level of safety (or inefficacy...) From what I can tell, I'm probably being over-cautious, but if there were any thoughts, I'd be most grateful.

Apologies, and thanks for any counsel here.


Edit: Just to clarify, the old Spike formula (just caffeine and sulbutiamine, no yohimbine HCL).